quote:

---

Originally posted by ginsu classic:
Frankly, I'm sick of the politician line: "We need to show that America speaks with one voice." You dumb bastards! We don't! Don't they get that?

---

Right. And for those (very many) of us that don't agree with what the so-called "one voice" is saying, there's kind of this feeling of, f*ck, where does that leave me? Doesn't my voice count for anything? It leaves you feeling really like an invisible outcast in your own country. So much for free speech... or I guess we can say anything we want, it's just that no one will listen, at least no one that can do anything about anything... grrrr. Very frustrated.

quote:

---

Originally posted by ginsu classic:
Frankly, I'm sick of the politician line: "We need to show that America speaks with one voice." You dumb bastards! We don't! Don't they get that?

---

She pointed out an article that quoted the White House as saying they wanted to deal diplomatically with North Korea, back when we thought those scud missles were theirs. Her point was simply that they should react to Iraq in the same manner.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Lis:
The anchor brought up the point that the polls are in favor of Bush. I'd like to know who they're polling. Aside from a handful of people, most people I've spoken with do not agree with what's happening.

---

I don't know. I overhear a lot of pro-Bush stuff, not necessarily pro-war, but pro-Bush. Though I don't really trust polls to be accurate at all either.

wandering out of this thread grumbling because it's more than I want to think about right now

quote:

---

Originally posted by ginsu classic:
Frankly, I'm sick of the politician line: "We need to show that America speaks with one voice." You dumb bastards! We don't! Don't they get that?

---

Amen to that. I think politicians do get it, but I think the collective hit we took from Vietnam make it traitorous if you don't "support our young men and women in uniform". I do support them to the extent I am worried about them and pray for their safety. But I can do that and be proud of their general service to our country without thinking their mission is just.

quote:

---

Originally posted by BionicGirl:
I don't know. I overhear a lot of pro-Bush stuff, not necessarily pro-war, but pro-Bush. Though I don't really trust polls to be accurate at all either.

---

Psst...BG...this is Texas.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Jezabel:
Psst...BG...this is Texas.

---

Ha! Yes, but somehow, I don't think they are only polling Texans.

quote:

---

Originally posted by breana:
HER government is run by a mountain climbing, bungee jumping, I wear pants when I meet the queen so deal with it woman for goodness sake, how do I top THAT?

---

OK, I'll admit I'm not a fan of the guy and I missed the first half or so of the speech. I kind of got the impression that he was playing off of Americans' emotions about 9/11 to rally us behind the war against Iraq.

From what I heard on the radio this morning, it worked and a lot of callers were in favor of war, citing 9/11 as a reason to strike first, b/c "terrorism isn't immenent until it's too late." Others said they were fearful Hussein would sell weapons to terrorists and that was reason enough to strike.

There is a grassroots campaign underway to protest war in Iraq in a simple,
but potentially powerful way.

Place 1/2 cup uncooked rice in a small plastic bag (a snack-size bag or
sandwich bag work fine). Squeeze out excess air and seal the bag. Wrap it
in a piece of paper on which you have written, "Rice for Peace - No War on Iraq."

Place the paper and bag of rice in an envelope (either a letter-sized or
padded mailing envelope--both are the same cost to mail) and address them
to:

President George Bush
White House, 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. NW
Washington, DC 20500

Attach $1.06 in postage. (Three 37-cent stamps equal $1.11.)

Drop this in the mail TODAY. It is important to act NOW so that President
Bush gets the letters ASAP, preferably before the report from the
inspectors comes out on January 27th.

In order for this protest to be effective, there must be hundreds of
thousands of such rice deliveries to the White House. We can do this if you
each forward this message to your friends and family.

There is a positive history of this protest! In the 1950s, Fellowship of
Reconciliation began a similar protest, which is credited with influencing
President Eisenhower against attacking China. Read on:

"In the mid-1950s, the pacifist Fellowship of Reconciliation, learning of
famine in the Chinese mainland, launched a 'Feed Thine Enemy' campaign.
Members and friends mailed thousands of little bags of rice to the White
House with a tag quoting the Bible, "If thine enemy hunger, feed him."

As far as anyone knew for more than ten years, the campaign was an abject
failure. The President did not acknowledge receipt of the bags publicly;
certainly, no rice was ever sent to China.

"What nonviolent activists only learned a decade later was that the
campaign played a significant, perhaps even determining role in preventing
nuclear war. Twice while the campaign was on, President Eisenhower met
with the Joint Chiefs of Staff to consider U.S. options in the conflict
with China over
two islands, Quemoy and Matsu. The generals twice recommended the use of
nuclear weapons. President Eisenhower each time turned to his aide and
asked how many little bags of rice had come in. When told they numbered in
the tens of thousands, Eisenhower told the generals that as long as so many
Americans were expressing active interest in having the U.S. feed the
Chinese, he certainly wasn't going to consider using nuclear weapons
against them."

From: People Power: Applying Nonviolence Theory by
David H. Albert,p. 43, New Society, 19.

This site has more info.

[This message has been edited by BionicGirl (edited 01-30-2003).]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Princessjeanne:
Did anyone else hear Powell's speech? What did you think?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Cosmichippy:
The thing that scares me most about this war is that despite the fact that the majority of Americans and the world have reservations into entering this war, the American government is acting as though none of that matters.

---

Where did you read that the majority of Americans oppose military action? The polls I've seen show the US and the UK to be split almost down the middle.

This poll from millions of AOL users shows the split better than a poll of a few thousand ever could:
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/030217/172127_1.html

quote:

---

Originally posted by emmalola:
I was at the huge-o-mungus peace rally yesterday in New York. Reading the papers today doesn't do the rally any justice, but the incredible world-wide aversion to war in Iraq was demonstrated yesterday and today with peace rallies and marches on a global scale.

I've never been part of such an amazing march before. did anyone else participate in a peace demonstration this weekend?

---

I didn't, because I live in a very, very conservative state that got 13 inches of snow this weekend, so any protests that might have happened, didn't. But I wanted to say that I was very, very moved my your diaryland account of the protest and really wish I could have been experienced it myself.

Phone polls are also somewhat biased (exxcluding non phone owners) but they can be conducted in a much more scientific way than any online poll can be, and can reach a better representation of the population by using random digit dialing to select a cross section.

If I polled people at the vet's center in town, my results would be very different than polling people at the university -- nonscientific polls don't accommodate for such differences.

quote:

---

Originally posted by greschya:
So regardless the source, pro or con, the methodolgy of a poll is important to consider too.

---

Good point. Polls seem to be pretty problematic in general.

quote:

---

Originally posted by greschya:
And, since it was conducted by AOL, it is also focusing on a specific group of internet users -- their own.

---

I was thinking the same thing, except my thinking was tainted by, "Ew, AOL. Ew." But then, I'm a snob.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/02/18/international/18CND-PREX.html